Newsgroups: php.internals
Path: news.php.net
Xref: news.php.net php.internals:105464
To: Rowan Collins <rowan.collins@gmail.com>, PHP internals
	<internals@lists.php.net>
Thread-Topic: [PHP-DEV] Revive Number Format Separator RFC
Thread-Index: AQHU+7D7OGXgdVHJp0Ci/FG71ATk06ZNpzIAgAA/dgCAAGMjAIAANcrr
Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2019 15:30:59 +0000
Message-ID: <DM5PR06MB28571784529EEF18B079D813DE3E0@DM5PR06MB2857.namprd06.prod.outlook.com>
References: <DM5PR06MB28578FFCD3349CF7F41F33FDDE3D0@DM5PR06MB2857.namprd06.prod.outlook.com>
 <CAEYWF=7dVBsbFUnK27OV7rfg7e=rsZ9jcv0Q=VFKND6p=OPYFA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAEYWF=7s5CW-zAobmJYvr5hj9-K7gU123WVkjZwnth-p-9uYLQ@mail.gmail.com>,<CALKiJKp5q_ja54S7o-H56iWjegfXCmhvDSy-cO6wBxj4roc-mA@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <CALKiJKp5q_ja54S7o-H56iWjegfXCmhvDSy-cO6wBxj4roc-mA@mail.gmail.com>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1
x-tmn: [8U7nmLxmpcdL+MysuzWHC4cozmE0phUS]
x-ms-publictraffictype: Email
x-incomingheadercount: 43
x-eopattributedmessage: 0
x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:(2390118)(5050001)(7020095)(20181119110)(201702061078)(5061506573)(5061507331)(1603103135)(2017031320274)(2017031323274)(2017031324274)(2017031322404)(1601125500)(1603101475)(1701031045);SRVR:BL2NAM02HT133;
x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: BL2NAM02HT133:
x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: tR/teUxI4jSDvCfzJujxU9VIV/G1M2t5WaO9/dSrbI3bE7AMG7DLkWp5nG9XkVdQ6cuTYecNDaeovy8caV7J/FDwzF2xD99SJV3dao5tj29YBX+SGq9Ea7DeeC/KVQTvSOnpXL+e09XxUAr5K8LLxmnPmmH0fnPQuioWwQkyVyvClUvu8/Oy5Qhx7tTtqWSZ
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-OriginatorOrg: outlook.com
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-RMS-PersistedConsumerOrg: 00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 11571e92-332b-4547-8f05-08d6ca5c2f62
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-rms-persistedconsumerorg: 00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 26 Apr 2019 15:30:59.9283
 (UTC)
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Internet
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 84df9e7f-e9f6-40af-b435-aaaaaaaaaaaa
X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: BL2NAM02HT133
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Revive Number Format Separator RFC
From: theodorejb@outlook.com (Theodore Brown)

On Fri, Apr 26, 2019 at 6:10 AM Rowan Collins <rowan.collins@gmail.com> wro=
te:=0A=
=0A=
> On Thu, Apr 25, 2019 at 6:07 PM Theodore Brown <theodorejb@outlook.com> w=
rote:=0A=
>=0A=
> > Is there any chance the Number Format Separator RFC [1] could be revive=
d=0A=
> > for PHP 7.4? I looked at the discussion from a few years ago and it's=
=0A=
> > not clear why many people originally voted against it.=0A=
>=0A=
>=0A=
> I'm not particularly against this proposal, but I'm not sure how often I'=
d=0A=
> use it.=0A=
=0A=
How often you use numeric separators depends on what you are doing.=0A=
I definitely agree that phone numbers and dates are not good use cases,=0A=
and that there are usually better ways to write things like the number=0A=
of seconds in a day or number of bytes in a gigabyte.=0A=
=0A=
However, there are many other appropriate uses of large integers=0A=
where numeric separators can make the code more readable and=0A=
prevent mistakes. Here's an example from code I maintain:=0A=
=0A=
```php=0A=
function getActiveDirectoryTimestamp(DateTime $date): int=0A=
{=0A=
    // Active Directory stores dates as the number of 100-nanosecond=0A=
    // intervals since January 1, 1601.=0A=
    $epochDiff =3D 11_644_473_600;=0A=
    $secondsAfterADEpoch =3D $date->getTimestamp() + $epochDiff;=0A=
    return $secondsAfterADEpoch * 10_000_000;=0A=
}=0A=
```=0A=
=0A=
Another common use case is constants used in scientific calculations:=0A=
=0A=
```php=0A=
const ASTRONOMICAL_UNIT =3D 149_597_870_700;=0A=
const SPEED_OF_LIGHT =3D 299_792_458;=0A=
=0A=
echo 'Time for light to travel from sun to earth: ';=0A=
echo (ASTRONOMICAL_UNIT / SPEED_OF_LIGHT) . ' sec.';=0A=
```=0A=
=0A=
For me personally the most frequent use case is actually in tests,=0A=
where various values (e.g. large dollar amounts) are passed to=0A=
functions in order to validate business logic. Numeric separators=0A=
would help make such unit tests a lot more readable.=0A=
=0A=
Best regards,=0A=
=0A=
Theodore Brown=0A=