Newsgroups: php.internals Path: news.php.net Xref: news.php.net php.internals:104100 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mailing list internals@lists.php.net Received: (qmail 73908 invoked from network); 4 Feb 2019 11:16:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail-pf1-f173.google.com) (209.85.210.173) by pb1.pair.com with SMTP; 4 Feb 2019 11:16:19 -0000 Received: by mail-pf1-f173.google.com with SMTP id 64so6382894pfr.9 for ; Sun, 03 Feb 2019 23:57:09 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:to:cc:references:from:openpgp:autocrypt:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language :content-transfer-encoding; bh=edhKkB4Flim95MHIJb6jgKUkVgeyAL/KvK7TIgaFHho=; b=TrOqEOSdcFP7OThKTriwU8JSyBgdTigQcMW7t4S1LPgtBe+ft0lENrpfkQ+PisZa+w Y9Yr2D/4bDIjBiVYMd+KsulJpmfljFQ4hB+NNd+wQRdXeJylo1lzyqYXXQPuaxyVwk5R /iS5isY5armPEcoz3McoMrT5RXIWiRPsW3S35Tgm+SyTomjXKlLP1ccIPo5MxKmpNHwL 06rtVYb+eXcncxV5zuyrXGx1x5fd0WnTuEUF3wbFxMrIBr8CvE4hikGN7/Co2iTiR13t yWtCCnWjutusj4LfSFdKD9AAFDqSpaua37bqutqIGFVv2bCa4dBf3SRdf4D5dqGa6P76 s0EA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:cc:references:from:openpgp:autocrypt :message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to :content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=edhKkB4Flim95MHIJb6jgKUkVgeyAL/KvK7TIgaFHho=; b=NhuYxgwOUIQ2n7mf6P7nAzACWDDTyPf1AjTuAoODFue8yHLnTnQbfbfzrYM5Bamyk9 hnM9RAnU5luVHxlRKdqE29P7M1h11mYauQeahVO8f69RY30ACDptn5hEUbBhPAkqV0GN XakckJlFCxqwdnJcPQDef9VwWqO062b003TaH6WpVn6X/fz4dBL9bixDiYOFE+7dwve9 H193rQZZHTIYhq1h8lHhIBhDng0X5t3xZXShrH+X6hPReTuRG2QK1nt7DKVbCHUj7T8a SNHQWqCPeilIV3VbfeozlN6/23xzQ/q9/LG1jOZEvgHS2HoSKgXtVTLwP0o+VeNS/eGM TNug== X-Gm-Message-State: AJcUukc5OS3PTxe1GKiJ9gUxJim3HttkuqVswFWkQGc76VI3dqjBl9vi 0bqSwfBeDMSUQOF7o72xh8hPlpU= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ALg8bN58q1cibVrjXC+npQVaRUOiIO6H3yEbkVM5gjpO7VXB9MBgdU90jNzs2Nybyd20qpZFHtjBWw== X-Received: by 2002:a62:2702:: with SMTP id n2mr51192915pfn.29.1549267028201; Sun, 03 Feb 2019 23:57:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from Stas-Pro-2016.local (c-24-4-176-254.hsd1.ca.comcast.net. [24.4.176.254]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id m67sm25685545pfb.25.2019.02.03.23.57.07 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 03 Feb 2019 23:57:07 -0800 (PST) To: Dan Ackroyd , Nikita Popov Cc: PHP internals References: Openpgp: preference=signencrypt Autocrypt: addr=smalyshev@gmail.com; prefer-encrypt=mutual; keydata= mQMuBE9mqaARCACFSqcGmNunkjQQu3X+yXnTmFeEkvM4JXZTOBdR8aEevNGmmFEfyvjaDjWi 9hcwp4E/lYtC+P7VsVjM1OSX9eq0jC/lGL0ZyRXek+mNy0n5H1NSuTpf9Y18LMqhc4G+RU+L cNiZ9K0DJuOOvNLPxW7OHZguxb3wdKPXNVa2jyRfJAKm2uaJJMT1mTmFT9a0Q8SKr+mUrrJk uG0H2o6SzrKt8Wwoint1eh67zVsJaJtQFchnEZnlawIcqP2yC4nLGR3MkubowxoEBYCZet18 aHVVRbvpG2Qtob8Lu5xrsGbmXymTkHTdpvkfcJFADa8MzOL90zOxXwbGfbIZOlh5En8jAQCX lfnx2eQL3BSW/6XANa51dbWiEp1d1BAkpGKtZvlk0Qf+M9WAi+9aXMe3xP5krxtgnRNUf2WN 6Zdy2MxL1RRJCFbytLhl0ronC49BsGYVGshdEH8xhBbiIOJKuVZ/DTl9bEm7P9c7CC7iJyVC khUAhouH6xzZQNLR+RU+QebYzXypVfl99Qk7EdMmr/WAZCHLuvanyqepC5EBsa3VnAfQemSN oBeGBKWWLiOsPjvS72+y1z4RUMAfXHn4l/sFMt8zt7/74AmJPwZquV41p4mPO12V4+xPyc6R sB84sfsk2QVivU8w8AkvGQeYjXoz7Iwao95+fWteVzZ36KRQvUckP8pGjHlDXnHxJ0HI1I/k OBZSjwRwUf0dd73y6erPhbLk+gf+NdI3H9KGJBzG5/rVyWKwUeQ9d5ud4jTJRkQGvAP5pg76 vEa9dogbpe4W5Z+0BfbiJSnQmQWSHiZddj/t33ptbup44Ck6ZTgdlmFYMLF1hR47PIZTDKER EuKYGci/vq8snZvEJP9YCw/TtiHcMdrMKcY/+Lp8lQO0GHLPB9glVhnC0db6l1Xpg1CMI8/R ozBMcij30EgATggC/y2zbiqAFoS9FN9nXPbe4phStqABEyeZ+nXudt7PUYTjVgcrqo8bHZCi sBobWC7OnKyUzxVxzUeuPkIfmZuzkLaMw2McQdvwwsNvQ0DzaLP30c1Xsm/7EIYJcOWpzlVJ 5QrdmE0/BbQyU3RhbmlzbGF2IE1hbHlzaGV2IChQSFAga2V5KSA8c21hbHlzaGV2QGdtYWls LmNvbT6IegQTEQgAIgUCT2aqtAIbAwYLCQgHAwIGFQgCCQoLBBYCAwECHgECF4AACgkQL3lW vF2gS12XMwD9HuRIolSwIK77u8EY461y2u6sbX36n5/uo/LDQuxoi3sA/0MvpnvzOhv9Iufv vsZEj3E7i3h+iD5648YMwfTFCij+uQINBE9mqaAQCADfZPMpjZkkGZj3BY/7ApoLq4mwqzbh +CpLXwNn20tFNvSXfb8RdeXvVEb7Scx+W9qYpiaun2iXJgCVH8fgpZpR856ulT1q6uCG++CX ubEvip/eJkZl93/84h04KQJwsgOrAh0Om3OePRn8Pr+++0LNS0EL8uX/YHeTOGOnnmTqYTey SBVFdov6L4mepddfjekicKQqhL7mZh/xuq29JijT0uNNX8v4vDWQDu5dlAcdd+uB3gcXMD/P ginD11zp+6wtrWCm/+yBqpvDwXQX5PGUnwvbRfl7Ay3MmwmoXiecZMg0dwTSc7e0lhB4HGRH ZdBMJB4rHUVGdzqujK/ctOvrAAMFB/0Utb76Qe6sCMlHxVAmeE/fbo7Pi05btZ/x01r67dHf aMSP0riCKJ7M0OW+jAXtu9+z/BVnYisW67WWfxl2cS5tZDgiHgJARXWUOO72+sScHP8KQmTl 1z16gyKbwY3SmyBkwcpOL35nhUWNLy93syPoY6sZUTikr2bZYukHDQ33XBPs4e6MbWKfsa9q aVmnlOF3k5UqChjutfHaEa4Q7VP4wBIpphHBi9MI16oJIzzBPbGl2uoedjwiZ6QeQZnSuOVY ZxU2d3lRA8PrtfFN1VSlpEm/VcAvtieHUYWHN0wOu+cp3Slr5XJVNjTjJhl28SlinMME54mK AGf2Ldr/dRwXiGEEGBEIAAkFAk9mqaACGwwACgkQL3lWvF2gS126EQD/VVd3FgjLKglClRQP zdfU847tqDK4zJjbmRv5vLLwoE0A+wbrQs7jVGU3NrS0AIl5vUmewpp2BKzSkepy23nWmejw Message-ID: <772223a5-32d0-ad3f-5a82-b45ba8d1a007@gmail.com> Date: Sun, 3 Feb 2019 23:57:06 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.13; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Alternative voting reform: Streamlining the RFC process From: smalyshev@gmail.com (Stanislav Malyshev) Hi! > Without a required discussion period, there could be slightly more > 'incentive' for RFC authors to respond as quickly as possible, to 'get > the discussion out the way'. I see it exactly opposite - since we have no quorum requirement, declaring the vote as soon as possible if a couple of people like your proposal and nobody objected yet seems to be winning strategy. By the time people analyze it more in detail and decide to voice objections the vote would be half done, and by the time they read the answers and want to continue the discussion, the vote would be finished. The right thing in this scenario would be to vote "no" immediately to any RFC that you didn't read yet and then start the discussion. This looks like rather wrong process. > It should be made really clear to people raising RFCs, that choosing > to have the minimum voting time, particularly if the discussion didn't > seem to produce a clear consensus can be, and possibly should be, > interpreted by voters as a reason to vote against an RFC. The problem, again, is, as you said, you don't read internals for weeks. I may also have periods where this happens, and I suspect others too. Now you come back and discover a blitz RFC already in the second week of voting, and you don't even know what it's about. So your choice is - read it and ask questions now, and take chance that the vote would be done before you even get an answer, or immediately vote "no" on all unknown RFCs and then maybe change your vote later. I don't think encouraging such things would create a good process or be encouraging to new RFC authors. -- Stas Malyshev smalyshev@gmail.com