Newsgroups: php.internals Path: news.php.net Xref: news.php.net php.internals:103955 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mailing list internals@lists.php.net Received: (qmail 38550 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2019 00:38:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail-ot1-f67.google.com) (209.85.210.67) by pb1.pair.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2019 00:38:26 -0000 Received: by mail-ot1-f67.google.com with SMTP id u16so4146583otk.8 for ; Thu, 31 Jan 2019 13:18:24 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=2z8DTO4UFjpXe0YTKANj82fBwxnTD4w91KQrBjZcYrI=; b=KxjeMDRojx8BBi8pUIdqodplH1fynvgccAKGv6Bi/4EMSernEm7UnZYSp/KPWGBAIM /GMNwaYmeUVobRYHOdAxzqLCwBsxctdoZE+5dIsIv+6mnNLDsjDAw/8Uj0wzJzDTKjkM sFnDdCJ9wUMx/OiDnK10TLLIwefYRAYrOBfHGxN/9MQwgf0z7q31hnHRO2iS/aW4O4nP rFWmuj/FKWi28Ry7AoIU8rIc1LUEEtnNQySG3jtfQdRUhgo34z4/bQo7uzQWTMYk91pq ZuR+gMdt8WSJLWICZdCX+0eGRSalxAMcCXF5Xbv0bYJGc5Ssfnf1S/TfmJ2VwjumB7tL iFLw== X-Gm-Message-State: AJcUukdCq7p9Fz5cHZeQAE2NODlQsIIaGsRXgBimTySVQiU2iYhRP47V /J51hy1Iz8FB21xxeWXHQSj/1dsmDwLiVXLmja0= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ALg8bN7ybIAfxuzHKwvn448uyGLWmJ4ZpezTigkdu2HRz7WijnwOkHTSAbJAV440H+4qaXiF57PNlfcT8cIAlIpLUaU= X-Received: by 2002:a9d:5c6:: with SMTP id 64mr27304114otd.274.1548969504343; Thu, 31 Jan 2019 13:18:24 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <8d9dffd5-ea2c-e642-b777-4a4fd76b261a@zend.com> In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2019 23:18:13 +0200 Message-ID: To: Zeev Suraski Cc: Dmitry Stogov , Nikita Popov , PHP internals Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] JIT From: kalle@php.net (Kalle Sommer Nielsen) Den tor. 31. jan. 2019 kl. 19.04 skrev Zeev Suraski : > As long as we can agree that very few actually deploy on Windows, I think= we're on solid grounds. > As the JIT implementation is likely to have at least some significant dif= ferences compared to Linux, I'm not sure what testing it on Windows would g= ive you. JIT is supposed to be entirely transparent, and the performance c= haracteristics - as well as the bug patterns - are likely to be quite diffe= rent on Linux vs. Windows, at least in many cases. > Is it really that important to have? I think we can easily agree on the fact that by no means Windows is the top candidate for production. For me personally from a project standpoint, I believe it is something important that we can have a PHP that is pretty much as transparent and identical no matter what platform you are on, which is something I have tried to do myself by implementing various Linux routines for Windows natively to make PHP as platform independent as possible. > I'm honestly a bit perplexed by how many people here viewing Windows supp= ort as a must have, while at the same time I think we all agree PHP is very= scarcely found on production Windows servers, and JIT is a predominantly p= roduction feature. With above being said, then I do also agree with you here, but I would like to have such functionality and improvements to our core system be as global as possible, naturally I don't think its fair either to require it so desperately upfront, but it should be a heavy consideration with the amount of work that we all have put into making Windows support one of the best among programming languages of similar category. > It'd be interesting to evaluate the cost associated with supporting Windo= ws. Bare in mind, we're proposing to vote on this as a production feature = for PHP 8 - which realistically means almost two years from now *at the ear= liest*. I'm sure we'd have Windows support a lot sooner than that if we de= cide that it's a must have. I agree with Nikita that the key question is i= n fact, do we or do we not want to introduce JIT in - with the main questio= n being the maintenance cost. Let's tackle this question first, otherwise = - why send Dmitry (and maybe others) for doing more work (Windows support) = if we are likely to flush it all down the toilet? I don't think it would be fair either to simply dismiss the idea and many years of hard work for a detail like platform support either, and that is not the way I hope anyone would cast their vote. > I think that if we reach the conclusion that Windows support is a must, w= e can condition the inclusion of JIT based on having it. Let's first agree= on whether we want it in the first place. Agreed. Naturally I would contribute in what I can to work on those parts (Windows). --=20 regards, Kalle Sommer Nielsen kalle@php.net