Newsgroups: php.internals Path: news.php.net Xref: news.php.net php.internals:101110 Return-Path: Mailing-List: contact internals-help@lists.php.net; run by ezmlm Delivered-To: mailing list internals@lists.php.net Received: (qmail 28420 invoked from network); 8 Nov 2017 15:22:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO lists.php.net) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 8 Nov 2017 15:22:56 -0000 Authentication-Results: pb1.pair.com smtp.mail=php@golemon.com; spf=softfail; sender-id=softfail Authentication-Results: pb1.pair.com header.from=php@golemon.com; sender-id=softfail Received-SPF: softfail (pb1.pair.com: domain golemon.com does not designate 209.85.220.172 as permitted sender) X-PHP-List-Original-Sender: php@golemon.com X-Host-Fingerprint: 209.85.220.172 mail-qk0-f172.google.com Received: from [209.85.220.172] ([209.85.220.172:48784] helo=mail-qk0-f172.google.com) by pb1.pair.com (ecelerity 2.1.1.9-wez r(12769M)) with ESMTP id 6D/36-15386-E41230A5 for ; Wed, 08 Nov 2017 10:22:55 -0500 Received: by mail-qk0-f172.google.com with SMTP id a142so3747243qkb.5 for ; Wed, 08 Nov 2017 07:22:54 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=golemon-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id :subject:to:cc; bh=QXstO5YfkUL0GEU0+xqyptRE5EtguAT3cedzrAhdj60=; b=1Sd8c0ghAYIb9llpSBK6Ps/LG/WG7Ww7bHPu3yZJkC2QErqGq6PXxiyc73iIBi3z9+ ozDLe4JGDYMdVU2DabM83vflziXIdIQ/tA3dyhAfWEs/uhSXevHqp/ytHPXUVVDtYjwp NeBjQi1AVls6XEFRtXUOHHgyML7OVMVErUvw7tUNbVpc5SJZ9a8ixJgnCEfq7ZfwYgV9 cM608XOMNLkj82ekkNdCwg7WnCfan/PvsJPCkL33J0ijEgk03SoW9r9afSX7yT7zU4Eu 8FjJbaLBkPB0MrdrzuPDOaeoa+HifMzl1CgBgbOvz03hm2wm7AKFeRR327vOWtePVcmW Nrag== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from :date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=QXstO5YfkUL0GEU0+xqyptRE5EtguAT3cedzrAhdj60=; b=ihQf69ll1LsKsAFvKmeOY7V52Xmrw3NqlYjZEbxz58/LkT5eeFoF47hhKvk02CELUn NdJKpUYOZAdnY0Q8emWuS6EEGIqnF8RMCKvyDMDdEh1DOSQkOCIoNtbJrhby4wc7wjBk 1Wtnv5atkaAooVpTOqR4bxazB4weompgE0gFGwX01hWz+Yd6pdsY1rRfnG9MdjDTC1GO u8rTpGh2SAQCsSO1vbLpkzgeTggzOlIxCcgzOZI64i5pqJADKjMcSmGO9ZJDt0nY9R2h SM8658hPioCZABCXeHFtwAqDOntG3qZAVwjkg/N7eD1k34aZR+RERgayuR7IpVsHMPOj JSlA== X-Gm-Message-State: AJaThX4UzpCXDyj+mlHhpKt4Ic9RgCAouXqFRhPnhrN9YeyjLIPr62xT iN0tX6nTlIeiuqKkLvMipk+PDc9vJQD5/gATxqWnvg== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGs4zMbTEGtEUAZuYpFVuI4xCqmPV2C0/4MAWTkv5VyfhHQq6cYpJoNF3vuEH/n+G49zz4GckARxoNqdNmuZBxgyV3U= X-Received: by 10.55.71.72 with SMTP id u69mr1281982qka.289.1510154572248; Wed, 08 Nov 2017 07:22:52 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: php@golemon.com Received: by 10.12.156.1 with HTTP; Wed, 8 Nov 2017 07:22:51 -0800 (PST) X-Originating-IP: [194.74.0.66] In-Reply-To: References: <077d8e99-3aac-c9ca-bce4-aa90c98ed075@heigl.org> <1510070893.27420.85.camel@ctankersley.com> Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2017 10:22:51 -0500 X-Google-Sender-Auth: P8wxqTuRwkxoGEWZ-aAER_vor44 Message-ID: To: Rasmus Lerdorf Cc: PHP internals Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: PHP's mail servers suck From: pollita@php.net (Sara Golemon) On Wed, Nov 8, 2017 at 9:56 AM, Rasmus Lerdorf wrote: > It isn't super-helpful to publicly shame our active volunteers. > There are many not-super-helpful things here, for example: Ignoring an inability to subscribe to the mailing list for YEARS isn't super helpful. Preventing project discussion from happening on the project mailing list isn't super helpful. Pretending that nothing is wrong isn't super helpful. Allowing the ranks of systems@ to shrink, but never grow isn't super-helpful. Focusing on "the mail server and the mailing list are two different things" rather than addressing or even acknowledging real issues isn't super-helpful. systems@ having literally no idea how to add authorized senders to moderated lists isn't super-helpful. -Sara